A Discussion

In response to this article:
http://www.americanthinker.com/2008/03/obamas_anger.html

[19:25] Fashiggity: i cant picture myself putting my name on this article if i wrote it
[20:54] MixedMike: people usually don't like hearing the truth
[20:54] MixedMike: even less so when it's the truth about their motivations, actions, or lack there of.
[20:55] MixedMike: myself especially. =P
[20:55] Fashiggity: the truth is only as valuable as it's received
[20:55] MixedMike: true
[20:57] MixedMike: i think he presented it in such a way that it can be motivational and its truth would be self eveident without having to beat someone over the head with it.
[20:58] Fashiggity: the reason why im curioius as the ethnicity of the writer
[20:59] Fashiggity: is because i mildly disagree that we shouldnt try to involve the 'anger' of race relations, etc..
[21:00] MixedMike: well i'm sure you could find out the ethnicity of the author without too much trouble.. i really havn't been interested enough to look
[21:01] MixedMike: as for anger in race relations, i think that a certain amount of anger is okay, but if you use it as an excuse to do nothing, then it's a waste of time
[21:01] Fashiggity: true
[21:02] Fashiggity: but he does marginlizes all african americans as wanting to 'owe' something
[21:02] Fashiggity: when there are actual african americans that succeeded on their own merit
[21:02] Fashiggity: and bases that in comparison to the asian american experience
[21:03] Fashiggity: its a touchy area when a person from one ethnicity critiques another ethinicty foreigh to his/her own
[21:03] Fashiggity: *forein
[21:03] Fashiggity: *foreign.. grrr typos
[21:03] MixedMike: haha it's okay
[21:03] MixedMike: he does generalize but i think that those generalizations hold water
[21:04] MixedMike: it's a small part of the black community that has done well for themselves, and those few are told that they sold out, or are called "uncle toms"
[21:05] MixedMike: i direct you again to clarence thomas
[21:06] MixedMike: he should be a shining example for the black community and yet he's held in contempt, in contrast kobe bryant or any superstar athlete is a hero.
[21:06] MixedMike: but then again, the concept of being "owed something" is not unique to the black community
[21:06] Fashiggity: true.. but thats another argument within itself
[21:06] MixedMike: i can see that in the asian community
[21:07] Fashiggity: it is his opinion to which i agree.. but at the same time we should agree that as one (or more) ethnicities, we will never understand hows it like being another ethnicity
[21:07] Fashiggity: we always see it from the outside biased from our personal experiences
[21:07] MixedMike: the fact that a lot of my friends parents did well for themselves, their kids, my friends, feel like they deserve to have all the money and the privilages that go with their status without the work that goes along with it
[21:07] Fashiggity: and its something that i myself learned never to touch upon
[21:08] MixedMike: i suppose thats the safe approach and except for this one instance it's something that i've gone along with myself
[21:09] MixedMike: but i think that people need to learn to get beyond race, because in america of 2008
[21:09] MixedMike: if you can not do well for yourself, it's not because someone else is holding you back
[21:09] MixedMike: it's because you're holding yourself back
[21:10] MixedMike: whether it's ambition, motivation, or desire.. you have to be lacking in one or more of those things to not succeed in the amercia of today.
[21:11] Fashiggity: i agree
[21:11] Fashiggity: and race is yet an obstacle, exclusive to people of color.. and while i stand by this fact, im not advocating using it as an excuse.. its a hurdle we need to get over
[21:12] MixedMike: i agree
[21:13] MixedMike: but i contend that it has now become an obstacle largely in the persons mind and rarely if ever institutional or enforceable.
[21:13] Fashiggity: look at obamas run for the nomination to the presidency as an example
[21:13] MixedMike: hmm?
[21:14] Fashiggity: if people werent celebrating the fact that hes a brotha that won new hampshire
[21:14] Fashiggity: then yes, i say race does not exist at all
[21:14] Fashiggity: and of course its not so much there are people still prejudiced by a black president.. he gets more flack from his own community whether or not he's 'representing them right'
[21:17] MixedMike: how society percieves race is one thing.. and it's interesting to watch the democrat race
[21:17] MixedMike: but my comments go to the individual
[21:18] MixedMike: i think the voluntary segregation of the races is part of the problem
[21:18] MixedMike: and is most of the reason why race relations haven't gotten better
[21:18] MixedMike: people would rather think of themselves as black, mexican or asian, than as an american.
[21:18] MixedMike: even the people who use all the hyphens =P
[21:19] Fashiggity: mm hmm
[21:20] MixedMike: i think my point of view is widened by the fact that i'm mixed and have kind of an ambigious affiliation to the asian culture
[21:20] MixedMike: but it's with a kind of one foot in/out deal